What is "reasonable" for airsoft?

Ask yourself this though. If you have a target 180t away, how many shots would it take for your airsoft M4 to hit it? You could say just one, but what happens if it misses do to air resistance, a drop of rain, a leaf, etc etc. With an actual M4, you can be guaranteed as long as youve properly aimed youll hit that target 100/100 times. In airsoft, youll rarely see a guy fire once and hit another player at 180ft, just one shot, nothing more. The effectiveness of ammunition is not the same, hence you need more opportunities to get hit the target in order to make it more realistic, hence hicaps/drum mags.

Airsoftguy238 wrote:Milsim is what you make it I think. If you wanna go out there in MC and a $30 crossdraw with some hicaps and you wanna call yourself milsim go ahead. If you wanna go out there with a legit CIRAS, sport a GBBR and some extra mags and you wanna call yourself milsim, go ahead. Its really what you make it and there are degress of milsim-ness I think. Ive got MC cause it works not because some of the military is just now using it. I've got a replica CIRAS cause I got it for my birthday. And I've got midcaps cause I hate winding. And I have a 30+ rps scar, cause well, high ROF is fun and is a definate advantage. I don't aim for milsim I just wanna like what I use and I think a lot of other players are like that.

MILSIM is not what you make it. MILSIM and Airsoft are two different things and should not be confused.

^ Precisely, so why does everyone make a fuss about different setups?

I believe airsoft is airsoft, it is not the Military, the only similarites between the two is that the guns look the same and the gear looks the same.

#CW!!ZERO wrote:I believe airsoft is airsoft, it is not the Military, the only similarites between the two is that the guns look the same and the gear looks the same.

+1

Aggressor wrote:^ Precisely, so why does everyone make a fuss about different setups?

shameless good book plug . . .

Twitch wrote:I still think that saying BANG BANG BANG is the most mil-sim of all. You know I'm right paul.

And everyone has to pull back their charging handles when they change mags.

Hey now

I still want someone to buy a minigun so we can rig it to my durango....

Electioneer wrote:MILSIM is not what you make it. MILSIM and Airsoft are two different things and should not be confused.

+1. Very rarely do we get actual milsim games here in GA. Milsim has a lot more to do with interacting with role players/variables, patrolling, etc, wheras airsoft is more of just shooting and whatnot.

I personally don't like hicaps. I use hicaps in my M14 because I don't feeling like shelling out a ton of money for G&P mids, and because I'd also need to buy a rig that can hold a lot of 7.62 mags. I do however use mids in the L85, and of course in the shotgun I just have the 10-shot shells.


If you've never tried playing with a gun that puts you at a distinct disadvantage, you've got to try it. It really makes you have to slow down and think. Especially when you're in a leadership position. For me, when I'm playing TL or SL, I've really got to focus on realizing that I can't be effective by myself, and when I realize that is when I lead the best. One of my most recent moments in which this was true was at ZombieFest during Game I, when I realized that I couldn't hit a guy with my shotgun, so I set up and ran BD1A on the cornfield. I had David set up a couple guys as support, and I had Max and Cody run assault. If I had been using my SOC16 and hicaps, I may have feelt perfectly fine just to sit back and engage random targets. I have a tendency to do that sometimes. Heck, if you remember during the summer, I'd occasionally go without a gun just for the fun and challenge. And to tell you the truth, I was actually pretty effective without a gun, getting bunker tags, playing as a scout, etc. When you put yourself at a disadvantage, you have to turn on your brain. And it's a TON more rewarding/exciting when you outsmart someone rather than just shoot them b/c you have a better gun and a bigger mag (like the time I PWND Jack at Zombiefest...)

Just my .02. Of course you can't have EVERYONE go out there on the field without a gun, but trust me, it's a fun thing to try. Because if you get hit early on, well, you didn't have a gun, so it's acceptable. But if you do something special, it's a rush.

#CW!!ZERO wrote:I believe airsoft is airsoft, it is not the Military, the only similarites between the two is that the guns look the same and the gear looks the same.

not to burst IC's bubble, but according to your philosophy stated above you guys should have no problem with box mags. Airsoft is a game, people can play it the way they want to... if they wanna carry around a crap ton of ammo so they don't have to haul extra mags and/or reload during a game thats their choice. It's not like you look down upon people in airsoft if they have a SAW and are trying to fill a role (no offense to anyone). People just stereotype people with box mags. Not everyone that has a box mag sits in one place and holds down the trigger and even if they did, maybe there is some tactics involved, maybe they are trying to hold down a position/area or something for all we know. In the end, it all comes down to how YOU want to play. Midcaps, box mags it doesn't matter. It is a playing style. If you really have a problem with it, take it on the field and prove you can be just as affective with midcaps than a box mag, it might only make you feel better inside but complaining about how unrealistic it is when we say we aren't mil sim just doesn't make sense.

this isn't directed entirely torwards IC but to people who dislike box mags in general

airsoftsniper25 wrote:

#CW!!ZERO wrote:I believe airsoft is airsoft, it is not the Military, the only similarites between the two is that the guns look the same and the gear looks the same.

not to burst IC's bubble, but according to your philosophy stated above you guys should have no problem with box mags. Airsoft is a game, people can play it the way they want to... if they wanna carry around a crap ton of ammo so they don't have to haul extra mags and/or reload during a game thats their choice. It's not like you look down upon people in airsoft if they have a SAW and are trying to fill a role (no offense to anyone). People just stereotype people with box mags. Not everyone that has a box mag sits in one place and holds down the trigger and even if they did, maybe there is some tactics involved, maybe they are trying to hold down a position/area or something for all we know. In the end, it all comes down to how YOU want to play. Midcaps, box mags it doesn't matter. It is a playing style. If you really have a problem with it, take it on the field and prove you can be just as affective with midcaps than a box mag, it might only make you feel better inside but complaining about how unrealistic it is when we say we aren't mil sim just doesn't make sense.

this isn't directed entirely torwards IC but to people who dislike box mags in general

But as Aggresser said about the Drum mags for M4, G36, etc. Do you think it is realistic to have those items on weapons that were never built for them?

Bulldog94 wrote:

airsoftsniper25 wrote:

#CW!!ZERO wrote:I believe airsoft is airsoft, it is not the Military, the only similarites between the two is that the guns look the same and the gear looks the same.

not to burst IC's bubble, but according to your philosophy stated above you guys should have no problem with box mags. Airsoft is a game, people can play it the way they want to... if they wanna carry around a crap ton of ammo so they don't have to haul extra mags and/or reload during a game thats their choice. It's not like you look down upon people in airsoft if they have a SAW and are trying to fill a role (no offense to anyone). People just stereotype people with box mags. Not everyone that has a box mag sits in one place and holds down the trigger and even if they did, maybe there is some tactics involved, maybe they are trying to hold down a position/area or something for all we know. In the end, it all comes down to how YOU want to play. Midcaps, box mags it doesn't matter. It is a playing style. If you really have a problem with it, take it on the field and prove you can be just as affective with midcaps than a box mag, it might only make you feel better inside but complaining about how unrealistic it is when we say we aren't mil sim just doesn't make sense.

this isn't directed entirely torwards IC but to people who dislike box mags in general

But as Aggresser said about the Drum mags for M4, G36, etc. Do you think it is realistic to have those items on weapons that were never built for them?

Most of the people who have posted on this topic have stated that we doesn't necesarrily play airsoft the mil-sim way, according to that then it doesn't really matter if they have a drum/box mag for whatever kind of gun they have. Again, its a playing style and they can have it on their gun if they wish. Most people play airsoft for fun, if they think it is fun to have a box mag then it doesn't matter, they go to the games to have fun. In their minds, its not about being realistic and they don't care what over people think about them having a box mag.

airsoftsniper25 wrote: if they think it is fun to have a box mag then it doesn't matter, they go to the games to have fun. In their minds, its not about being realistic and they don't care what other people think about them having a box mag.

Amen!

The good thing is that we have the opportunity to choose and teams/clubs may continue to form to reflect these tendancies. Many areas of the country have groups that back the formation of events that specialize in more restrictive games and those can serve as models for folks wanting that style of specialized play here as well.
Unfortunately, airsoft is much like other sports such as bowhunting where those who shoot traditional might look down on those who shoot compounds and vice-versa. We all face the choice of banding together like hunters must in order to protect the overall right to hunt or being divided and likely face pressure against our sport/game as a whole:
Wood vs. Aluminum bats
Longbow vs. Compound bows
Muzzleloader vs. Centerfire rifles
Persimmon vs. Metal Woods
Forged vs. Cast Irons
Paper vs. Plastic bags
We can separate or unite . . .
As for me, I'm gonna sling plastic . . . LOTS of it!

Twitch said that not me.

Q-bald, thanks for your post on the first page



heres my opinions on magazine capacities, Im pretty sure im quoting from what Firby said back on the s.a.c forums

"3 bbs = 1 bullet"


I think that makes a lot of sense. The first shot you take might just be to get an idea what projectory your bb is following (EX: curving because of wind, hop adjusment etc) and watching where the 2nd bb hits, you can properly allign your weopon where you desire your bb to hit.

Sometimes when you take those distant shots, people dont realize theyve been hit and you may have to fire a few additional rounds.

Airsoft guns will never be as percise as a real firearm

Therefore a midcap magazine holding 70 rounds is fairly accurate and lowcaps are kinda like a handicap unless your shooting .3s with a rifled barrel shooting at like...... 450 fps!

i am haji wrote: Eh, but drum mags, personally i dont care whether or not you use. Yes you can argue they exist but they do not simmulate how heavy those things are

Thing is, I can promise yall no one, not even milsim players, would be down for a real weight M249 or M240Bravo. Drum magazines on an M16 or any other 5.56 variant weapon really arent that heavy, the M16 I have and the M4 I have are both heavier than the real steel counterpart anyhow, so Id think its safe to say it be a fair approximation.I have been on FTXs over the course of multiple days whilst using actual firearms with drum magazines, so this is where I am getting my approximations. A fully automatic M16 with a drum mag is believe it or not rather manageable, its just very prone to jamming and overheating (hence the use of the M249). On the other hand, a drum magazine utilizing 7.62 ammunition is significantly heavier, even a belt of 100-linked 7.62 rounds can make a 240Bravo feel even heavier, which is a feat in itself.